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+--- Thread: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning (/showthread.php?tid=26250)
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - TacoLand - 2023-12-01
Glad I got to see and camp out at Lemoigne Canyon back in March 2020. Years prior a park ranger told me it wasn't a widely used road and nature was slowly reclaiming it. Wondering if this was the nail in the coffin.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - GowerGulch42 - 2023-12-01
That would really surprise me because it provides a good amount of camping space in the center of the park, particularly on busy weekends.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - TacoLand - 2023-12-01
(2023-12-01, 01:04 PM)GowerGulch42 Wrote: That would really surprise me because it provides a good amount of camping space in the center of the park, particularly on busy weekends.
That's a good point with regards to the amount of camping space. I was there for a few days and saw no one, but it was also the very first week of the pandemic & shutdowns.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - GowerGulch42 - 2023-12-01
That's our usual campsite when we visit - usually we'll have it to ourselves, with maybe one other group way at the top of the road. On busy holiday weekends though, I've seen probably no less than a half-dozen groups more than once. The first 200 yards through the wash keeps most people out.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - Beardilocks - 2023-12-03
It was open after the Aug 2022 floods but then closed after the winter rain 22/23 that re-closed North Rd just after it opened back up. AFAIK it never opened back up after that before Hilary hit.
It wouldn’t surprise me if NPS left it closed. Seems to me they’re on a path to closing or permitting most of the back road camping areas. I hope I’m wrong.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - AlanMcR - 2023-12-05
(2023-12-03, 01:50 PM)Beardilocks Wrote: ... Seems to me they’re on a path to closing or permitting most of the back road camping areas. I hope I’m wrong.I think you are exactly correct. It's really depressing.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - GowerGulch42 - 2023-12-06
Decided to go digging through some of the laws and regulations. They haven't permanently closed a road (that I've been able to find a record of, excepting those with unrecoverable damage**) since 1994, and it's a bureaucratic nightmare to do so. I wouldn't be surprised if they ask you to tell the park where/when you'll be camping it's a big area and that would be very helpful for S&R, but with over a million visitors per year they're in no position to further restrict camping options. Expanding the NPS campgrounds won't ever happen as they've nearly maxed out the available space for those and don't have the staffing to maintain them. Establishing definite, constrained campsites on the close-in, heavily trafficked areas is a no-brainer and probably the best crowd control measure they've made in a while, no matter how unpopular it is among us. Frankly, those areas like Greenwater, Cottonwood, Hole-in-the-Wall, are so heavily used anyway that I'd never camp there. There's no upside to restricting backcountry camping outside of those heavy use areas.
As for "being reclaimed by nature"… I could say that about any number of the 1000+ miles of unimproved roads in DV. The NPS has a legal responsibility to maintain vehicular rights of way - to close them they have to prove to the Federal Highway Administration that there's sufficient reason for closure, and that would have to also go through a period of public comment, and it would take years. The road the NPS would REALLY like to close is the Eureka-Saline road over Steel Pass. They can't, because it's a reserved right of way. The only a right-of-way can be eliminated and placed into Wilderness is by an act of Congress. There is no law against them putting a "Road Closed" sign in front of a road though, and they can enforce that as long as they like as with Keane Wonder or Titus. The right-of-way remains.
There's still a contingent of "humans are evil" Sierra Club folks at the park and DVNHA, even after the departure of Callaghan.
** Surprise Canyon even is a weird special case - the portion of the road that washed out is property of BLM, and BLM subsequently closed that portion. The NPS portion in Panamint City remained open for a time until they were able to close it because it became inaccessible. The old right-of-way is preserved, and still outside the wilderness.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - GowerGulch42 - 2023-12-06
Just for fun… there's a patch of new imagery on Google Earth from 11/23/2023 covering the area around Scotty's Castle and parts of the North Highway. You can see that the Scotty's Castle road is done and it looks really good. Completely new alignment in many places. You can see a few areas of major damage on the N. Highway too.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - Beardilocks - 2023-12-12
Update:
Looks like Harry Wade, Warm Springs, and Mengel Pass are now open to 4wd high clearance vehicles.
Interestingly West Side Rd is not open North of the junction. I thought the Amargosa Crossing was the crux of that but apparently not. No idea what’s holding up West Side Rd opening.
RE: Death Valley CLOSED: Fall/Winter 23/24 Trip Planning - TacoLand - 2023-12-12
Just came here to post all of that ... thanks, Beardilocks.
With those openings it's getting really, really hard not to tell the extended family to kick rocks for Christmas, ’cause I'm headed to DV.